[RP] High time for frankness and honesty

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:20 am

Faradorn wrote:Right, well I am going to be frank throughout for the whole of this, so if you can't tolerate that, I'm not going to force you to read. This 'between the lines' lark is getting nobody nowhere. I've inadvertently been thrown into this and I'd really like to know what is going on. People are playing back room politics far too much these days. I'm trying to get to the bottom of this royal mess, possibly to save my own hide, and to stop some silly decisions being made.

Council has decided to withdraw from a judicial treaty with Chester based on several factors, including their new legal corpus. Several councilors and residents of Stafford have reviewed the legal corpus of Chester and have some concerns. The new legal corpus of Chester will directly affect our county specifically with regards to their strict market regulations and their failure to abide by the King's decrees. Stafford is not willing to endanger the lives of our councilors to uphold laws with such blatant disregard for the King's law. Effective immediately, Duke Tazatron has been informed that Stafford has canceled our judicial treaty until such a time as their laws are amended. It is our hope that Chester will heed our legal advice and adopt changes to comply, even in its basic structure, to the King's laws and decrees. The working relationship between Chester and Stafford will be professional in the House of Parliament despite the attempts by Chester councilors to bait, harass, and instigate civil war between our two counties.

What King's laws have been violated by a county legislating on their own market? It's a pretty heavy accusation and seems to be a bit vague. Please clarify. Also, please clarify where this has endangered the lives of the Stafford Council. The actions made seem to be also harsh when one considers County sovreignty, which has always been sacred in any legal decision.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you follow the steps to justify war? Like I said before, I'm being frank and asking straight questions here. If one follows the theory that a war can be justified if certain criteria are satisfied, one of these criteria would be that it is the last resort. You seem to be taking steps, with the last one being war. Am I right?

Just War Theory:
Last resort - Not just yet.
Proportionate - I'd say any fight would be a close to equal one, casualties and costs would be disproportionate.
Authority - I guess you have the authority to wage war with County sovreignty, but national bodies might look at it in a bad light.
Intention - You say we are endangering your lives, yet you are giving literally anyone carte blanche to create armies right on our borders, while our laws are there to protect our people from fraudsters and monopolies who would starve our people. Who is endangering more life?
Promote good and fight evil - I'm sure Stafford is not evil, but surely Chester isn't full of mass murderers committing genocide.

National News:

Council has decided to discontinue a mutual and friendly relationship with the county of Cumberland. Stafford has spent the past two years attempting to ratify and sign a judicial treaty with Cumberland numerous times. Their lack of respect and decency to acknowledge our requests, both locally and nationally, have not gone unnoticed; as a result, we have decided to cease the following actions:

1. Stafford is ending any and all trade agreements with Cumberland county.
2. Stafford is recalling the ambassador sent to Cumberland county.
3. Stafford will cease sharing military intelligence of any kind, including any regarding threats from Scotland with Cumberland county.
4. Stafford will cease in our efforts to aide Cumberland county with troops and/or supplies in your efforts to close your borders with Scotland or any other county within England. After more than one �accidental� death due to misuse of hit lists during travel bans, we will not take a chance of our traders that are trying to provide material support being injured or killed with no means of compensation or justice available. Or worse, Stafford county providing troop support and our citizens being responsible for any of these �accidental� deaths as instruments of Cumberland county�s shortsighted misuse of hit lists and/or travel bans.
Why have you severed intelligence ties regarding border security? Where is the reasoning for this distanced decision. Why have you withdrawn troops from the borders, endangering the people of Cumberland and of England as a whole, to send them home where they aren't really needed in comparison. Are you trying to weaken the borders of a Northern county, whilst strengthening your own? You blame this accident on Cumberland. Why? Because someone from Stafford said they are responsible for a private army which was badly administrated from the inside? I understand there should be accountability in a county but it's quite obvious Cumberland didn't wield those swords or point the finger towards Owfio, one of their own councillors.

National News:

A Chester councilor has threatened us with physical force should we raise armies as well as a request to the House of Parliament to sanction a revolt against the current council. We have sent word by Embassy to Chester so that this may be resolved. We await a statement from Chester in regards to these threats.

May I ask who threatened who with what, and where is your proof? This is very vague and has been seemingly deliberately kept quiet, except for the that that you accuse Chester openly of course.

Yes, some of these questions are leading and yes some of them are answered by themselves, but they are all very valid, and it's about time this transparency and accountability we hear about started kicking in. I think everyone is entitled to answers.

EDIT TO UPDATE - It would seem that Stafford has refused to answer the questions I have put forward to them, claiming that Chester Council knows the answers to my questions. This is physically impossible and it is becoming increasingly obvious that Stafford is using this thread to accuse me of inciting war by asking them these questions. They are refusing to answer to the community of England the questions I have asked and are simply accusing a single citizen of bullying an entire county. That too is impossible since I am but a man, and I am the one asking them questions about them using political means to bend counties to their own will.

UPDATE - As proof of my intentions to bring a resolution to this matter, I have offered my services and bringing about a new judicial treaty, after the Count of Stafford questioned why one hadn't been written up yet.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:20 am

Faradorn wrote:OOC: Sorry to double post but I didn't particularly want to edit such a large post. /OOC

Are you promoting factionism? Which is dividing our beloved country into two groups, who know who they are.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:20 am

Arthur_loxley wrote:Sir Faradorn, Councilor of Chester :

Please send your county's advocate to Stafford to understand the rationale and logic of Stafford Council regarding decisions made concerning both Chester and Cumberland. If you are unaware of who is your county's advocate, I'll give you a hint: It is the person who wrote your latest speech, the one who recently ran with your political party to gain power and did not succeed, the one who continues to harass, bait and instigate issues between our two counties despite not being from Chester.

I grow weary of the attempts of citizens from Chester trying to force 'accountability and transparency' upon England at the expense of Stafford. In case people are wondering, these excerpts are taken from a published Ducal report in the Stafford Inn to our citizens. Last time I checked, Sir Faradorn was a citizen of Chester. The decisions made by Stafford Council do not concern you or your ilk, so please focus on your duties in Chester. If you are bored, let me know and I'll ask your Duke to assign you more of the tedious tasks of running a county. Perhaps cleaning the pens of the pigs will keep you busy.. Also, feel free to speak frankly and honestly about Chester matters.

I will not continue to address issues aimed at attacking Stafford by you, your party members who want to wage war, or by your county's advocate.

Stafford County considers the judicial treaty matter closed.
Stafford County considers the issues with Cumberland closed.

Good day.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:21 am

Lorddragon wrote:

I'll give you a hint: It is the person who wrote your latest speech, the one who recently ran with your political party to gain power and did not succeed, the one who continues to harass, bait and instigate issues between our two counties despite not being from Chester.

I didn't think i was the Advocate for Chester County... but thank you Count Loxley for the introduction. Except i am from Chester County, but close enough.

Letters were sent back and forth between Chester and Stafford. When we asked for the reason why you found the laws the way you did... Your answers were vague. Diplomatic response was even less so.. Something along the lines of "There is no evidence to support that claim".

Are you saying that will be different this time? Try not to say that we have made no effort to try and rectify this situation when you shut down every time we tried.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:21 am

Faradorn wrote:Now look, firstly, before any more isnults start flying about under the guise of wit, I would like to say I write my own speeches, essays, discussions and they are produced based on my thoughts. The only thing I have checked are directed to the CoA, meaning I am not representing myself or the people who have voted directly.

I can count some times where Stafford have done what you accuse the Chester councillors of. Perhaps you remember when we withdrew from the NEA?

It is obvious that you should check your sources before you say I am pushing you towards a war. I think logic would have failed if I desired a county of 600 to go against the rest of England. You have made yet another unexplained claim.

You also say this does not concern me. Perhaps the Cumberland matter does not concern me directly, but when you make a decision which affects the county I live in. I think it does. Isn't it a bit sanctimonious that you made a decision to withdraw from a judicial treaty based on what Chester did within its own county, well within the laws, then criticise when a citizen of Chester asks why?

Perhaps your references to cleaning pig pens means you have lost contact with your citizens, I really do hope this is not the case. I am sure many of them do this on a daily basis if they are in the meat industry. Try to keep on a level with your people, this shouldn't turn into a power game.

Is it such a crime to want answers to decisions which whether you like it or not, concern me and citizens of Chester?

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:21 am

degas wrote:I don't think Chester is the problem. Stafford is run by Idiots and criminals. Look at who their Duke is.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:22 am

Myxti wrote:Myxti sighed and approached the group.

"OK, this is getting REALLY REALLY OLD! This whole thing started off because of TWO Stafford Councilors who did not agree on pretty much anything. After the one councilor decided to make decisions that did not beneift the county, just his...or her friends, he...or she lost support from Stafford Council members and many citizens.

A personal issue that started between TWO people is now being used to hopefully start a civil war.

I am not a Councilor at this time. I am with child and do not want nor need the extra stress. I am here speaking as a concerned Englishwoman who lives in Stafford. I may not be English by blood, but I AM an Englishwoman by CHOICE! I am worried that all of this propaganda is only aimed at justifying an attack. And for the record, I am not talking about Stafford. I know that they would not do that to England!!

Can we please let what started with TWO people end? It makes me sick in my stomach to hear and read so much propaganda aimed to provoke civil war. It's obvious that a verbal war has started or is being instigated. Certain 'frankness,' 'questions'...oh and ILLEGAL minute reading to the HoP from a PRIVATE closed door County Council area without permission and out of context are not true concerns, but again...propaganda."

Myxti sat down too sad and weak to continue. She really did not want to say anything. She was doing her best to stay away from situations like this. It would be awful if this drama caused her to lose her soon to be child. But, with all of the baiting and fighting, she knew that she had to say something. The back door politicing? Did that include threats from people she used to defend constantly no matter what? Painful this whole situation was and she wished that this bullying would just stop.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:22 am

Faradorn wrote:I think a sign of propaganda is vagueness. It would also seem that no matter what I say, I will be accused of inciting war. Prove me treasonous if you actually have proof of anything. If you don't, stop making baseless accusations.

I will say it again, Chester is not raising any armies, so what attack do we have to even justify?

This did not start between two Stafford councillors and I'm now sick to death that Stafford is trying to play the 'I'm being bullied' card yet again. They have withdrew a treaty to bend them to their will, they have withdrew troops from Cumberland which are desperately needed. How are they victims of bullying?

If questions can be considered propaganda, what on Earth are blurred accusations against another county.

Yes I have made this a public thread, but rather than try to instigate war, I have taken this out of the back room, which is currently preferred by many people, but just is not beneficial.

Instead of seeing answers to questions, we see them being swept aside and further accusations are made against Chester. When do the accusations without evidence end? Do not deflect.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:22 am

Slon wrote:I don't see why you won't let the matter rest. Stafford chose to not send soldiers to Cumberland and chose to withdraw from the Judicial Treaty with Chester because it didn't feel that its laws were fair, now please stop attempting to bait us. Have a nice day. Rolling Eyes

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:22 am

Arthur_loxley wrote:
Lorddragon wrote:

I'll give you a hint: It is the person who wrote your latest speech, the one who recently ran with your political party to gain power and did not succeed, the one who continues to harass, bait and instigate issues between our two counties despite not being from Chester.

I didn't think i was the Advocate for Chester County... but thank you Count Loxley for the introduction. Except i am from Chester County, but close enough.

Letters were sent back and forth between Chester and Stafford. When we asked for the reason why you found the laws the way you did... Your answers were vague. Diplomatic response was even less so.. Something along the lines of "There is no evidence to support that claim".

Are you saying that will be different this time? Try not to say that we have made no effort to try and rectify this situation when you shut down every time we tried.

I can't help but wonder... why is Faradorn speaking on your behalf against Stafford? Dragon, I wasn't referring to you as the advocate of Chester. Wink It wasn't a compliment.

Yes, Letters were sent back and forth between our two counties. I'm not sure how you would have seen them as it was private correspondence.. but oh well. It doesn't matter really. The matter has been closed in the eyes of Stafford. Why does Chester continue to harass us about every decision we make? Are you seriously not busy enough keeping your county running? Chester citizens should be questioning their own council for an explanation. If they cannot provide you with answers, then remember that in two months when elections roll through again. Wink

Stafford drafted a list of very specific reasons concerning the laws of Chester, which were summarily dismissed and ignored. You should know, you and the advocate of Chester, wrote it for your Duke. Hmm.. a trend is appearing. First letters.. now speeches.. what's next Ducal decrees?

Stafford has nothing to say concerning this matter. Thank you for your inquiry. Please go and second guess the decisions of your council rather than focus on Stafford.

Angelrevenant wrote:I don't think Chester is the problem. Stafford is run by Idiots and criminals. Look at who their Duke is.

I know why you are so bitter towards Stafford and I completely understand. Just because I, as Duke, refused your title transfer application does not mean you need to be bitter though. You were given a choice to move to Stafford and with hard work given a chance to obtain a peerage by your own hands instead of by the work of your brother, Degas. You have, till this day, not answered that letter.. It is fine though. With a little hard work, I'm sure you will gain a peerage in the lands of Cumberland.

Faradorn, you should be inquiring with your own local council and not the county of Stafford. It is not a criticism. It is pointing you in the right direction. Wink As far as armies not being raised in Chester, perhaps you are misinformed. A "training" army will be raised shortly in Chester, please go ask your Captain, LadyJennet.

You have made this public thread, to yes.. again.. bully Stafford. It matters not. Considering you are not from our glorious county, it is completely understandable that you have no knowledge of the inner workings or decisions made by our council. Thank you for your misinformed statements. Wink

As far as back room dealings, Chester would know best about that. Wink Stafford has had opened council chambers for almost a year and a half. As Duke, I have detailed minutes of all discussions, polls, and issues concerning Stafford. If you'd like to see them, let me know. No need to obtain them through back room dealings. They are a matter of public record, yanno. Wink

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:22 am

Faradorn wrote:I think I'm experiencing echo. Are you all being told to say something like this?

"If they ask why, just accuse them of baiting us"

This sounds very well rehearsed, but all I asked were some simple, important questions, and nobody will even honour them? Rolling Eyes

I know you are all also trying to act the reasonable ones also, that has pushed the pressing matters to the back and left everything very superficially pleasant. However, if this carries on, we will have more rash decisions like the very ones I'm asking about.

My original questions still stand.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:23 am

Slon wrote:Actually, I'm being told to keep my mouth shut..I think that its for the good of humanity or something like that. Laughing

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:23 am

Arthur_loxley wrote:
Slon wrote:Actually, I'm being told to keep my mouth shut..I think that its for the good of humanity or something like that. Laughing

Or something like that! Laughing

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:23 am

Faradorn wrote:Double post after a reply was made whilst I was too replying:

Yes, you have turned my words on me like a little schoolboy saying 'Your mom', when will our future's leave the playground. Rolling Eyes

Stafford is plain refusing to explain their decisions, that is not the fault of Chester, and you cannot put that blame on us or direct me to the Chester council, they cannot read minds.

Oh and by the way, no training army has been approved. I guess I should now ask where your source came from, as they are actually ignorant of what decisions have been made.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:23 am

Rainchaser77 wrote:Rain hears a familiar voice shouting and refrains from hiking up her skirts and running--if only just. She should not be doing this. Not now. She walks up and puts an arm around Myxti's shoulders and whispers just into her ear, a concerned look on her face, "What are you doing? You are going to do harm to yourself or the baby. There will be plenty of time afterward to fight." She says the last with a gentle smile, knowing her good friend and cousin will never stop fighting for what she thinks is right. It will be a good quality to impart on her new baby, especially balanced with Kenrich's patience and introspection. She stands and looks Faradorn in the eye, having only half heard Slon and Arthur's responses.

"Cousin, Stafford has been bullied when our representatives are called traitors and criminals and idiots and anti-English for disagreeing with the opinions of others. It has been going on for well over a year. I dealt with it as Duchess as did Lady Tiffanyanne before me and Lord Arthur is now. I'm sure Lord Alamothih can tell you similar stories and Lady Gabrielle has gone completely silent due to the constant badgering. The plain and simple fact is that Stafford is not required to maintain ties with any county for any reason if the representatives of our county deem that it is not beneficial. Any county does. Unity will only come when the counties of England benefit from it."

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:26 am

Faradorn wrote:I will never deny a county sovreignty, but you must understand why I want answers to these questions. I do not want to be slowly walking towards war when we can do something about it now. We must leave the back rooms, talk with our own citizens, then talk in the open about peace and restoring agreements.

Chester and Stafford once had a glorious relationship, and until recently, the citizens have been under the guise that this relationship is still immaculate. I was one of them once so I know exactly how it feels, I think the councillors need to talk openly. Can nobody see where I am coming from. I am not provoking anybody. If I wanted to wage war, I would have made called for recruitment to armies, made polls asking to wage war or recruiting spies. Apart from standard recruitment for the Chester Bowmen, none of this has happened. I am asking questions pertaining to decisions which affect Chester and her allies which remain unanswered. Some of these questions are admittedly there to inspire citizens to question the decision, others are there for me to gain knowledge of what has happened.

Can you honestly say I, or any other Chester Councillor, wants to go to war?

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:26 am

Steei wrote:then perhaps Faradorn it should be the rest of England respecting Staffords right as a council to go independant of England if they so choose

all I can say is if they didn't want to get asked the hard questions why did they run for council


I mean to hear them whine about it it is like we declared that noone from stafford county is permitted within Chester county

they find our protecting our markets to much to bear ok don't sell on our markets then simple

rain if you didn't have so many crimminals running your county maybe they wouldn't be call such or traitors and such

Stafford has cut off it's reporting intelligence of groups heading towards the border of England if that is not treasonous what is they place other counties at risk because the other counties refused to bend to thier will


now Loxley I don't care what has crawled up your backside and refuses to let you have a bowel movement get over it if any army you have allowed to be created crosses our borders and commits a crime I will hold all of Stafford county and its citizens accountable for it and I am just a citizen of the Fine county of Chester and of the Kings England


now be well and rest easy Staffordshirians your government has not brought wrath upon you yet

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:26 am

Arthur_loxley wrote:Faradorn,

Why does Stafford have to explain anything to you, a citizen of Chester? Should you not be here demanding an explanation from your own council? They were well informed. Stafford and Chester communicated for a period of two weeks (same amount as Stafford/Cumberland) prior to a decision being made. These issues are also not new issues, although some are (and continue). Stafford Council has adequately and sufficiently updated and informed the people of Stafford about the decisions and rationale behind the decisions made. The entire debate was held in public in a gallery was opened for the eyes of all interested citizens could have attended.

Can you honestly say I, or any other Chester Councillor, wants to go to war?

Do you really want to know the answer? I would say yes. Stafford has not threatened Chester with war, or mentioned going to war. However, there are many in Chester in back room dealings mentioning and plotting to conquer Stafford to expand Chester's holdings. Did you know this? Most likely not. Those who do have tried their utmost to maintain these discussions under wraps and now that they have been exposed are backtracking to contain it. By backtracking, they are trying to flip the script and blame Stafford to instigate a war.

I will say this here and now for everyone to hear: Stafford is NOT declaring war on the county of Chester. We are having war-games to increase activity and it is actually fun!

Steei.. you aren't even worth my time. Wink

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:27 am

Slon wrote:
Steei wrote:
rain if you didn't have so many crimminals running your county maybe they wouldn't be call such or traitors and such
If that's not slander and baiting then I don't know what is. Rolling Eyes

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:27 am

Rainchaser77 wrote:Her eyes narrow and she squares her shoulders. "When you are called traitor for months and months why on Jah's earth would you continue to give service to the people who call you such? The answer to that is simple. You. Do. Not.

"The Cumberland and Chester situations are separate. These discussions have taken place in open Stafford Council chambers. I am not currently a councillor, and I am well aware of what has been discussed, so do not assume that because Chester citizens have been kept ignorant that the same is true in Stafford. The information is there for those who care to look, including that Ducal report my dear cousin Faradorn quoted.

"Ties with Cumberland were cut because after nearly two years diplomatic advances continued to be ignored though Stafford sent aid and offered more in spite of continuing abuse from Cumberland citizens. Until the present council, requests to Stafford for aid from Cumberland followed the pattern of "We hate you. Send us money now you blankety-blank traitors to England. Thanks...traitor." With the new council, new contact was made, but sadly, it did not turn out anything productive.

The judicial treaty with Chester was revoked because your market laws are causing havoc on Stafford markets as people flee to sell their goods. More of them, coupled with actions of various Chester councillors led several people in Stafford to believe that our courts would be forced through the treaty to persecute people. As I said before, if relations are not mutually beneficial in roughly equal amounts why should they continue?"


Rain give Slon a little half-smile. "It is, but you get used to it."

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:27 am

TheRedChef wrote:Faradorn-
Maybe you should be addressing your complaints to the cowards in your councils hiding behind kings law (ooc: posting). Oh sorry, I forgot. They're the same people you've allied yourself with time and time again. So I'm not surprised you've decided that spreading vicious and inciting slanders against Stafford serves your purposes better then actual reason and honest inquiry.

We've explained several times so let me break it down for you, since you obviously didn't get it the first few times.

The people of Stafford will no longer support the incompetent bungling nor abet the multitudinous criminal acts committed by the several iterations of the Cumberland Border Forces. There has been a TOTAL lack of accountability in this regard. As much as I like Beemo, her council has completely and utterly failed to reform this and have completely ignored our concerns. Their lackluster response and shirking of all responsibility to the Owfio murder proved us right, and hardened our resolve. We will not waste our resources on such a boondoggle, nor will we put our people at risk.

There is also the issue of insult and ingratitude from Cumberland. We once extended aid to her, only to get venomous attacks in return from worthless slags like Degas. These are not the actions of a friend or ally.

If Cumberland wants to benefit from our defense, then she should become a county worth defending.

As for Chester, as I've beaten into you several times in the Court of Appeals, has a serial disregard for the law. In the recent revisions, Chester council has willfully decided to amplify the very worst aspects of their law and has tried ake end runs around the Court of Appeals. It is clear that Chester has NO interest in justice. We will not put the integrity of our courts and risk sanctions in order to enforce your shoddy and tyrannical laws. Our concerns were scorned and rebuffed. Therefore, we could no longer uphold our treaty with you and keep out conscience and ethics clear.

As detailed by Arthur, Stafford has been threaten by Chester councilors and their lackeys. As of yet, your Duke has not yet responded to our diplomatic overtures. This is the latest in Chester's failings as a friend and ally country. We have no regrets in the actions we've taken.

That must have been terribly confusing for you, so let me give you something in crystal clarity:

If Chester with her armed forces and agents, makes one false move, impinges even slightly on Stafford sovereignty, they will be cut down in a merciless slaughter. They will feel the full weight of the judicial hammer.

Stafford is done being pushed around and mistreated. Test us at your expense.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:28 am

Steei wrote:it's only slander if it is not true

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:28 am

Lorddragon wrote:
Arthur_loxley wrote:Faradorn,

Why does Stafford have to explain anything to you, a citizen of Chester? Should you not be here demanding an explanation from your own council? They were well informed. Stafford and Chester communicated for a period of two weeks (same amount as Stafford/Cumberland) prior to a decision being made. These issues are also not new issues, although some are (and continue). Stafford Council has adequately and sufficiently updated and informed the people of Stafford about the decisions and rationale behind the decisions made. The entire debate was held in public in a gallery was opened for the eyes of all interested citizens could have attended.

Can you honestly say I, or any other Chester Councillor, wants to go to war?

Do you really want to know the answer? I would say yes. Stafford has not threatened Chester with war, or mentioned going to war. However, there are many in Chester in back room dealings mentioning and plotting to conquer Stafford to expand Chester's holdings. Did you know this? Most likely not. Those who do have tried their utmost to maintain these discussions under wraps and now that they have been exposed are backtracking to contain it. By backtracking, they are trying to flip the script and blame Stafford to instigate a war.

I will say this here and now for everyone to hear: Stafford is NOT declaring war on the county of Chester. We are having war-games to increase activity and it is actually fun!

Steei.. you aren't even worth my time. Wink

Are you honestly saying the smallest county in all of England will truly march into one of the biggest and take it over?

Chester has 600 Citizens and Stafford has double that... just wow...


I can't help but wonder... why is Faradorn speaking on your behalf against Stafford? Dragon, I wasn't referring to you as the advocate of Chester. Wink It wasn't a compliment.

Count Loxley, I am the leader of The Hard Line party, the same one you made reference to make a bid for power of the council and not achieving it. I was the potential Duke, no one else. I was responsible for all the speeches as well. I'd suggest you check your source next time.

Faradorn is his own person and as such can ask anything he darn well pleases hence the choice of free will. He is also a Councilor of Chester County. He has also seen everything that Stafford has done against Chester and comes up with the same response which is... Huh!!!


Stafford drafted a list of very specific reasons concerning the laws of Chester, which were summarily dismissed and ignored. You should know, you and the advocate of Chester, wrote it for your Duke. Hmm.. a trend is appearing. First letters.. now speeches.. what's next Ducal decrees?

Is that permission to post your response? I am sure every one is dying to see how specific your response actually was. About as vague as the ocean is wet... but with your permission i am sure it can be shared with every one and they can draw their own conclusions.


As far as back room dealings, Chester would know best about that. Wink Stafford has had opened council chambers for almost a year and a half. As Duke, I have detailed minutes of all discussions, polls, and issues concerning Stafford. If you'd like to see them, let me know. No need to obtain them through back room dealings. They are a matter of public record, yanno. Wink

There goes any attempt of saying that things were taking out of private areas. In case you didn't know Chester County has been conducting more and more in public these days.

However since private correspondence can't be shared with the public, some things are behind closed doors. You send a message to the whole council telling them they messed up... that isn't really private anymore now is it?

I am sure you have some kind of proof, to share with everyone, right?


Faradorn, you should be inquiring with your own local council and not the county of Stafford. It is not a criticism. It is pointing you in the right direction. Wink As far as armies not being raised in Chester, perhaps you are misinformed. A "training" army will be raised shortly in Chester, please go ask your Captain, LadyJennet.

You seen a flag yet? Or are you saying you are the only county in the entire isle of England that can play in their own backyard?

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:29 am

TheRedChef wrote:Vagueness? Ha!

I told you when I was rendering your county into a heap of quivering judicial mush in the Courts, if you want a good laws and trials, you should have hired me and not relied on the inept counselors you employed. Like the rest of my councilmembers, I've got enough on my plate without having to backstop Chester.

It's not Stafford's fault that you guys can't write a just law even by accident, nor is it our job do clean up your messes or fix your broken system.

You were given enough to go on. Do a decent job as councilors for once and stop blaming us. We're not in charge over there. You guys are.

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Post  arthur_loxley on Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:29 am

Faradorn wrote:PAH, You accuse of hiding behind King's laws? That's darned rich! I always thought the law was there to protect us. Now you say there is shame in the law? Shame on you sir!

Speaking on the exact same laws you accuse us of using, tell me what King's laws we broken by legislating our market.

What LJS DID NOT say wrote:The market cannot be regulated, thieves and monopolies should and will always run free. I do not care if you cannot afford bread because someone bought it all, I do not care if some rich folk came and outpriced your corn and then left the town he didn't even live in, for his own profits. I want the market open and corrupted and that's that!

You mention that I have constantly allied myself with the same people Red. Perhaps loyalty is not something you value, but I do. Rather than revolt against legitimate governments and then turn coat for a massively ironic role, I have stuck it out.

How can you accuse me of backroom deals when I'm the one making this all public, I made this public because I know what it feels like to be left in ignorance. You also promoted that ignorance Count Loxley, but by then it was a bit late.

You can keep washing your hands of it all, but it is most definitely Stafford that made the decisions, now they are being questioned or discussed, you want to push the blame onto the people the decisions actually affect.

If someone goes to Chester and started robbing everyone, then jumped into your county, you would let them off because you terminated the treaty. Knowing what kind of people live in your county, the tactic doesn't surprise me. We will see how many 'ex' criminals there are. You can only play that card once.

It is funny that you should also mention reform as the reason behind why you took action against Cumberland, for that is also the explanation behind the action against Chester. This is pure technique to bend people to your own will. We aren't bullying Stafford, you aren't bullying us. You are strangling us.
[/quote]

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